gfmucci
Junior Forum Member
Learning PSE2021, coming from PSE9. Just received new Nikon P950.
Posts: 89 
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Post by gfmucci on Dec 16, 2020 21:40:18 GMT
On the Adobe web site I read the system requirements for each of these programs: Premiere Elements and Photoshop Elements.
There appeared to be no greater system requirement for Premier Elements than for Photoshop Elements.
Did I read that correctly? Is that your experience, for those who have used both?
So if Photoshop Elements 2021 works well for me with my system, then should I expect Premier Elements to work as well?
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Post by Sepiana on Dec 16, 2020 22:10:04 GMT
gfmucci, Premiere Elements is a video-editing program while Photoshop Elements is a photo-editing program. If you are interested in video-editing, the best way to find out if Premiere Elements will work well on your OS is to download the free trial and take it for test drive. Adobe Premiere Elements 2021As to Premiere Elements, . . . When we, Administrators, started this forum, the decision was made that its focus would be on Photoshop Elements and that anyone looking for help with Premiere Elements should be directed to the Adobe Premiere Elements forum. Over there users of this program will get the timely and expert help they need from Grisetti and Co. Adobe Community Support - Premiere Elements |
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gfmucci
Junior Forum Member
Learning PSE2021, coming from PSE9. Just received new Nikon P950.
Posts: 89
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Post by gfmucci on Dec 18, 2020 4:57:04 GMT
Then let me make this a generic question. (Actually, people over at the Premiere Elements (PE) forum danced around my questions without answering, and instead mentioned other photo editors - without saying, but inferring, that I'm better off with other video editors - without saying why.)
Except for differences in their features and interface, do most video editing/playback software perform the same in terms of their use of the same computer processing resources when processing the same video? Comparisons: Premier Elements vs. Window Video Editor or Movie Maker.
What has a greater impact on the computer processor: Image size or frame rate? For example, 720 @ 60fps versus 1080 @ 30fps.
Another example: I have a Fuji camera that shoots 1280 video at 60fps ONLY. A Nikon camera I'm interested in shoots 1080 images at 25 or 30fps. Will the latter video spec be significantly less taxing on computer processing resources, with smoother, faster editing and rendering?
Another example: I took the "test drive." I played back a video from my Fuji of 1280 @ 60fps on PE. It played with some chop on Premiere's "Auto" quality setting but played smoothly at its "Medium" quality setting. I played the same video on my older Movie Maker and it played smooth. I doubt that app has any "quality" adjustments and likely played at a default "Medium" quality or maybe even less.
My objective in all this: I like the idea of an integrated "stills and video" app like the Adobe combination of Photoshop Elements and Premiere Elements. But not if I get better performance from more basic video editing programs. Alternatively, if I shoot at lower video size and lower frame rates, which is ok by me, will every video editor work better given the limitations of my computer resource? How "low" will I have to go? What would be the optimum balance of image size and frame rate using a given photo editor with my given computer processor which is rated at a lowly 3200 on the processor Richter scale?
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gfmucci
Junior Forum Member
Learning PSE2021, coming from PSE9. Just received new Nikon P950.
Posts: 89
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Post by gfmucci on Dec 18, 2020 13:59:25 GMT
Here is a responsive reply to ONE of my questions from DPReview:
"In general terms, frame rate scales linearly. You need to process twice as many frames at 60fps as you do at 30fps, and only half as many as you do at 120fps. So the effort to encode and decode is approximately in direct proportion to the frame rate.
Resolution scales, again in general terms, as the square of the linear dimension. 1080 is only 1.5 times as much as 720, yet there are 2.25 times more pixels in a 1080p image as there are in a 720p image. This is because you get more pixels in the horizontal dimension as well as the vertical. 2160p (i.e., "4k") has 4 times as many pixels as 1080p.
So going from HD to 4K roughly quadruples processing requirements, while going from 30p to 60p roughly doubles them. Going from 30p HD to 60p 4K is around 8X more compute intensive.
These are all very approximate, because the encoding can be more efficient at higher pixel and frame rate densities. There's less inter-frame motion at 60fps than at 30fps, so less data is often required in an encoded stream. A scene with large uniform areas of colour doesn't take a lot more data to encode whether it's in 2K or 4K. So more static scenes with low quantities of detail tend not to scale up to the extent described above."
So yes, there would be an advantage of getting a camera that records videos at 1080@30fps (Nikon P950) versus 1280@60fps (Fuji HS50EXR) if one has limited computer processing speed - if we want to stay above 720p.
The remaining question is:
Given the same video image to be processed, say 5 minute snip at 1080@30fps on my mid level computer (benchmarked@3200, 28 GB RAM, SSD), would there be any notable difference in playback or editing speed/smoothness between: a) simpler programs like Windows Video Editor/Movie Make and b) Premiere Elements?
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Post by michelb on Dec 18, 2020 16:41:58 GMT
I don't think our friends in this forum have really used both softwares. Photography and video are too different. I agree with the choice of our administrators to stay with photo. It's a pity you did not get satisfying answers from the Premiere Elements team, they are always helpful and knowledgeable. They really help beginners for 'how to' questions about video and to explain the principles of video editing. It's totally different with discussions in Dpreview where you can find the best from experts or teachers as well as sterile theoretical disputes over the merits of various softwares and hardwares. Sadly, it seems that it's what you have experienced.
As photographers, if we may give an opinion about your questions, we can say that: - PSE and PE are sold as a bundle, but they don't have much in common except the organizer. Two worlds apart.
- Minimum requirements are always very minimal. (I know, here I only have 6 GB on the present computer for PSE21...)
- Requirements for video are much underestimated. I'd say you need four times the specs for photo! - graphic cards are important for video but they are not used much in PSE. For both photo and video, RAM is the key factor.
- Hardware specs are not all: I am struggling to find which external safety processes in my setup are slowing down my editing recently. I am also perfectly aware of the burden of many automatic background processes in the organizer and I use them only if needed.
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pontiac1940
CE Members
Posts: 6,359
Open to constructive criticism of photos: Yes
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Post by pontiac1940 on Dec 18, 2020 16:57:57 GMT
Just FYI I have PSE and Premier 2018. I do not use Organizer, never have and never will. (Recently purchased PSE 2021.) I don't take many videos, but used Premier several times. It seems to run well with my system...below. PSE could be faster and suppose I should get more RAM. My programs and working image folders are all in the SSD and I moved them to the D: drive when the SSD gets cluttered (and they are also backed up to external drives as well). My uncompressed RAW images are 48 MB. They load into ACR fast, but if I open (say) 10 images in ACR and then open in PSE they are slow to open in PSE. Most adjustment processes run ok in PSE 2018 and 2021. But back to your question, Premier and PSE work okay with my system.  |
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gfmucci
Junior Forum Member
Learning PSE2021, coming from PSE9. Just received new Nikon P950.
Posts: 89
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Post by gfmucci on Dec 18, 2020 17:50:45 GMT
Just FYI I have PSE and Premier 2018. I do not use Organizer, never have and never will. (Recently purchased PSE 2021.) I don't take many videos, but used Premier several times. It seems to run well with my system...below. PSE could be faster and suppose I should get more RAM. My programs and working image folders are all in the SSD and I moved them to the D: drive when the SSD gets cluttered (and they are also backed up to external drives as well). My uncompressed RAW images are 48 MB. They load into ACR fast, but if I open (say) 10 images in ACR and then open in PSE they are slow to open in PSE. Most adjustment processes run ok in PSE 2018 and 2021. But back to your question, Premier and PSE work okay with my system. You are my favorite video guy at the moment. Others have danced around my question. You nailed it. Thanks.
I might be pressing my luck with my "video" questions on this forum, but I'm glad you responded. This forum is one of the better ones out there.
My Processor: AMD A10-7700K Radeon R7, 10 Compute Cores 4C+ 6G @ 3.4 GHz (I don't know what 4C+6G means)
Currently installed RAM: 12.0 GB Currently installed HD: 2TB Proposed RAM: 28GB Proposed additional HD: 1 TB SSD
That is maybe around $250 in upgrades that I'm hoping will help with my moderate to light editing of both stills and video. Do I trust myself with the installation and reconfiguring the location of my files and apps? Probably not. So add another $60 to pay someone to install.
Premiere has 4 playback options: Auto, High, Medium and Low quality. Which one do you use? For me, Medium played well. Auto had a slight pause every few seconds. That was with my 1280@60fps video out of my Fuji Finepix HS50EXR. An added benefit to the Nikon Coolpix P950 I'm looking at is its video output would be 1080@25 or 30fps. That should be a lot easier on my editor and computer, do you agree?
Oh, and I need to ask: Why don't you like to use the Elements Organizer? And which one do you prefer use?
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Post by tourerjim on Dec 18, 2020 18:01:44 GMT
As Clive mentions Premiere runs well, I do a lot of video editing and main issue with video editing is the rendering time of the edited video and this will depend on your pc spec and size of your edited video, my advise would be to search information for pc video rendering.
Laptop 17 inch
Processor Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-6700K CPU @ 4.00GHz 4.00 GHz
Installed RAM 32.0 GB
System type 64-bit operating system, x64-based processor
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gfmucci
Junior Forum Member
Learning PSE2021, coming from PSE9. Just received new Nikon P950.
Posts: 89
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Post by gfmucci on Dec 18, 2020 18:20:50 GMT
I don't think our friends in this forum have really used both softwares. Photography and video are too different. I agree with the choice of our administrators to stay with photo. It's a pity you did not get satisfying answers from the Premiere Elements team, they are always helpful and knowledgeable. They really help beginners for 'how to' questions about video and to explain the principles of video editing. It's totally different with discussions in Dpreview where you can find the best from experts or teachers as well as sterile theoretical disputes over the merits of various softwares and hardwares. Sadly, it seems that it's what you have experienced.
As photographers, if we may give an opinion about your questions, we can say that: - PSE and PE are sold as a bundle, but they don't have much in common except the organizer. Two worlds apart.
- Minimum requirements are always very minimal. (I know, here I only have 6 GB on the present computer for PSE21...)
- Requirements for video are much underestimated. I'd say you need four times the specs for photo! - graphic cards are important for video but they are not used much in PSE. For both photo and video, RAM is the key factor.
- Hardware specs are not all: I am struggling to find which external safety processes in my setup are slowing down my editing recently. I am also perfectly aware of the burden of many automatic background processes in the organizer and I use them only if needed.
Ahaa! Another clear and appreciated answer. Most answers received at other places were "try it out and see if it works." While that's a true answer, it is not the most helpful. I suppose I was looking for geekier answers. Some have complemented (I hope) me by asking if I was an engineer. Nope, only a city planner.
My usage of the two Photoshop components will likely remain at >95% stills and <5% video. But even with such a minor usage, I would like it to work well.
I guess the Organizer is either loved or hated. Yes, if you let your Elements app sit for a while during which time you've added hundreds of photos by other means, the next grand opening of the app will result in a lot of reshuffling time by the Organizer.
In my case I love the Organizer and is the thing that causes me to want to stick with the PSE and PE combo, in spite of the advice of several to use other video apps. Maybe I'm being too hard headed or showing my ignorance, not sure.
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pontiac1940
CE Members
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Open to constructive criticism of photos: Yes
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Post by pontiac1940 on Dec 18, 2020 18:56:11 GMT
Why don't you like to use the Elements Organizer? I tried it years ago and found it awkward for one of the reasons you mentioned. Over the past 20 years I have accumulated 15 (or so) external hard drives. In the new year, I will move the 2020 images off the SSD and put in the D drive. I take a lot of photos (maybe, 10,000 to 20,000 annually...~20K this year). I might download two or three sets of 50 to 150 phots weekly....usually delete the majority. So I am moving images around quite a bit. Images are organized in date folders. I name a day's folder with date and usually primary subject. Then name individual image files with one or two keywords. Microsoft File Explorer is slow to search for random files so about one year ago I installed Everything search software. It is amazing. I digress. This is what my file system looks like.  |
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gfmucci
Junior Forum Member
Learning PSE2021, coming from PSE9. Just received new Nikon P950.
Posts: 89
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Post by gfmucci on Dec 18, 2020 22:21:38 GMT
Why don't you like to use the Elements Organizer? I tried it years ago and found it awkward for one of the reasons you mentioned. Over the past 20 years I have accumulated 15 (or so) external hard drives. In the new year, I will move the 2020 images off the SSD and put in the D drive. I take a lot of photos (maybe, 10,000 to 20,000 annually...~20K this year). I might download two or three sets of 50 to 150 phots weekly....usually delete the majority. So I am moving images around quite a bit. Images are organized in date folders. I name a day's folder with date and usually primary subject. Then name individual image files with one or two keywords. Microsoft File Explorer is slow to search for random files so about one year ago I installed Everything search software. It is amazing. I digress. This is what my file system looks like. Very nice, you created your own customized organizer. I'll have to check out the "Everything" searcher. If not for photos, it'll be for everything else I lose on my computer. Yes, Windows "find" is painfully slow. |
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pontiac1940
CE Members
Posts: 6,359
Open to constructive criticism of photos: Yes
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Post by pontiac1940 on Dec 19, 2020 4:14:58 GMT
Everything is very useful .. PC only. I use it two or three times every day. Will search for anything and everything and it's very fast. 
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Post by tourerjim on Dec 19, 2020 10:33:25 GMT
I'm same don't use PSE organiser, with my many thousands of pictures I can quickly search my own organiser.
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Post by cats4jan on Dec 19, 2020 15:43:49 GMT
Don't use Organizer - but can't say I'm organized. LOL
Actually, most of what I do is - 'been there, done that' - and finding it again isn't really necessary. But when it is - ouch.
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